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	<title>Comments on: All Star Monday Morning Standings</title>
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	<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/</link>
	<description>Edmonton Oilers Blog</description>
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		<title>By: dawgtoy</title>
		<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/#comment-40851</link>
		<dc:creator>dawgtoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 19:31:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://puttingonthefoil.com/?p=10229#comment-40851</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Completely agree with what you&#039;ve stated and obviously agree/understand based on the KLowe quote that this organization really shit the bed during those years. No farm team was a completely bone headed move to name one, but i agree they really sent mixed reviews as to what the organization was doing. You start with trading Smyth, that being a clear message of rebuilding, followed by signing Penner and Souray which demonstates the opposite. So I&#039;d completely agree that they were clueless as to which direction to turn. I&#039;d also agree that the two year rebuild timeline doesn&#039;t wash either. It had begun before drafting Hall, no doubt about that. So yeah we agree on the fact the rebuild started well before the MSM say it did.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Completely agree with what you&#8217;ve stated and obviously agree/understand based on the KLowe quote that this organization really shit the bed during those years. No farm team was a completely bone headed move to name one, but i agree they really sent mixed reviews as to what the organization was doing. You start with trading Smyth, that being a clear message of rebuilding, followed by signing Penner and Souray which demonstates the opposite. So I&#8217;d completely agree that they were clueless as to which direction to turn. I&#8217;d also agree that the two year rebuild timeline doesn&#8217;t wash either. It had begun before drafting Hall, no doubt about that. So yeah we agree on the fact the rebuild started well before the MSM say it did.</p>
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		<title>By: Racki</title>
		<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/#comment-40816</link>
		<dc:creator>Racki</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 06:37:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://puttingonthefoil.com/?p=10229#comment-40816</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I can see there easily being an argument for anywhere between now and a few years ago. I think Lowe&#039;s words state otherwise and that 2007 was the beginning, but their actions seem to contradict that, yes, for sure (I say though that it was more of a case of a quasi-rebuild where hey hadn&#039;t really fully committed and thought &quot;OK, maybe we don&#039;t have to do this&quot; when Gagner and Cogliano and Nilsson showed a glimmer of promise). My main point with that first comment in this post though was that it was ridiculous for the media (Tencer and Matheson in particular) to buy in that this is year 2 of the rebuild. That actually floors me that they would be suggesting that this is only the 2nd year. 

I think the Oilers didn&#039;t really have a good sense of how they wanted to rebuild, exactly, is all.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can see there easily being an argument for anywhere between now and a few years ago. I think Lowe&#8217;s words state otherwise and that 2007 was the beginning, but their actions seem to contradict that, yes, for sure (I say though that it was more of a case of a quasi-rebuild where hey hadn&#8217;t really fully committed and thought &#8220;OK, maybe we don&#8217;t have to do this&#8221; when Gagner and Cogliano and Nilsson showed a glimmer of promise). My main point with that first comment in this post though was that it was ridiculous for the media (Tencer and Matheson in particular) to buy in that this is year 2 of the rebuild. That actually floors me that they would be suggesting that this is only the 2nd year. </p>
<p>I think the Oilers didn&#8217;t really have a good sense of how they wanted to rebuild, exactly, is all.</p>
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		<title>By: dawgtoy</title>
		<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/#comment-40808</link>
		<dc:creator>dawgtoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 03:42:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://puttingonthefoil.com/?p=10229#comment-40808</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Let me simplify my point now that my wife and kids arent distracting me. I feel that at no point in time in 2007 was this team in rebuild mode. I&#039;d agree somewhat, that at the conclusion of the 2007/08 season, management had to see trouble on the horizon. In saying that I realize that there are more methods of rebuilding and retooling a team then the yard sale sell everything with a pulse for picks method. I just don&#039;t buy that Ryan Smyth being traded started the rebuild. The season ends strong, rookie line plays very well, but again no playoffs.  The off season brings two attempted RFA signings as UFA stay away from Edmonton, and succeed with Penner. Souray is the big UFA signing, and I distinctly remember people being optimistic about 2008. That optimism didn&#039;t last long, and I&#039;d agree that the cracks started to form, but barring the sale of the team to the Drugstore moneybags kingpin, the fully and completely full scale rebuild couldn&#039;t and didn&#039;t occur. Of course that being said, KLowe hiring Tambo signaled a loud and clear message that Edmonton was in full scale rebuild mode, did it begin earlier, I&#039;d say yes...but not 2007 early...IMO one season removed from the SCF, not that early....no way.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me simplify my point now that my wife and kids arent distracting me. I feel that at no point in time in 2007 was this team in rebuild mode. I&#8217;d agree somewhat, that at the conclusion of the 2007/08 season, management had to see trouble on the horizon. In saying that I realize that there are more methods of rebuilding and retooling a team then the yard sale sell everything with a pulse for picks method. I just don&#8217;t buy that Ryan Smyth being traded started the rebuild. The season ends strong, rookie line plays very well, but again no playoffs.  The off season brings two attempted RFA signings as UFA stay away from Edmonton, and succeed with Penner. Souray is the big UFA signing, and I distinctly remember people being optimistic about 2008. That optimism didn&#8217;t last long, and I&#8217;d agree that the cracks started to form, but barring the sale of the team to the Drugstore moneybags kingpin, the fully and completely full scale rebuild couldn&#8217;t and didn&#8217;t occur. Of course that being said, KLowe hiring Tambo signaled a loud and clear message that Edmonton was in full scale rebuild mode, did it begin earlier, I&#8217;d say yes&#8230;but not 2007 early&#8230;IMO one season removed from the SCF, not that early&#8230;.no way.</p>
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		<title>By: Racki</title>
		<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/#comment-40804</link>
		<dc:creator>Racki</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 00:22:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://puttingonthefoil.com/?p=10229#comment-40804</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That&#039;s sensible reasoning, Dawgtoy, however I&#039;ll direct you to the quote from Kevin Lowe back in 2007 when he said &quot;there’s no question we’re back in a rebuilding situation&quot; (&lt;a href=&quot;http://lowetide.ca/blog/2007/11/50-million-dollar-rebuild.html&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;credit Lowetide&lt;/a&gt;). 

If anything, I would say that they&#039;ve been floundering around cluelessly not 100% committed to winning, not 100% commited to a rebuild, or perhaps just plainly not knowing how to rebuild. I think some people associate a rebuild with the way a team like Pittsburgh and others have rebuilt - sucking horrendously bad for a long while. Rebuilding to me more implies out with the old, in with the new... although having a few high first rounders as part of your &quot;new&quot; isn&#039;t so bad. 

Anyways, I&#039;m not sold that the Pittsburgh rebuild was ever really a plan for them. I think they&#039;ve been trying to rebuild the team for a while now (when Kevin Lowe said it seems like a good starting point), and in those couple of years where we sunk to the bottom of the barrel, it wasn&#039;t planned.. but they committed to not doing anything to get our of there. That&#039;s when this rebuild probably showed some promise however, since being the #1 loser means you also get the number 1 (or 2 thanks to the lottery) pick, which of course is generally a special player. 

Anyways, saying this is year 2 of the rebuild (not what you are saying.. what others like Jim Matheson have said) is beyond ridiculous. I can half buy 2009 as the starting point, but I&#039;d say thats maybe just when they got more effective in it, thanks to some horrible hockey and bad luck with injuries.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s sensible reasoning, Dawgtoy, however I&#8217;ll direct you to the quote from Kevin Lowe back in 2007 when he said &#8220;there’s no question we’re back in a rebuilding situation&#8221; (<a href="http://lowetide.ca/blog/2007/11/50-million-dollar-rebuild.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">credit Lowetide</a>). </p>
<p>If anything, I would say that they&#8217;ve been floundering around cluelessly not 100% committed to winning, not 100% commited to a rebuild, or perhaps just plainly not knowing how to rebuild. I think some people associate a rebuild with the way a team like Pittsburgh and others have rebuilt &#8211; sucking horrendously bad for a long while. Rebuilding to me more implies out with the old, in with the new&#8230; although having a few high first rounders as part of your &#8220;new&#8221; isn&#8217;t so bad. </p>
<p>Anyways, I&#8217;m not sold that the Pittsburgh rebuild was ever really a plan for them. I think they&#8217;ve been trying to rebuild the team for a while now (when Kevin Lowe said it seems like a good starting point), and in those couple of years where we sunk to the bottom of the barrel, it wasn&#8217;t planned.. but they committed to not doing anything to get our of there. That&#8217;s when this rebuild probably showed some promise however, since being the #1 loser means you also get the number 1 (or 2 thanks to the lottery) pick, which of course is generally a special player. </p>
<p>Anyways, saying this is year 2 of the rebuild (not what you are saying.. what others like Jim Matheson have said) is beyond ridiculous. I can half buy 2009 as the starting point, but I&#8217;d say thats maybe just when they got more effective in it, thanks to some horrible hockey and bad luck with injuries.</p>
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		<title>By: dawgtoy</title>
		<link>http://puttingonthefoil.com/2012/01/all-star-monday-morning-standings/#comment-40784</link>
		<dc:creator>dawgtoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jan 2012 18:07:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://puttingonthefoil.com/?p=10229#comment-40784</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;comment-40679&quot;&gt;

&lt;strong&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-40679&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Racki&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;: 
Oh wow, is this one early for this coming Monday??  


Anyways, I think it’s silly too if the Oilers are really considering trading Gagner or Peckham. But, it does depend on the return, yes. If Nashville called saying “We’ll take Peckham and Gagner for Weber”, for example, I’d hang up the phone immediately and send it in to the NHL for approval. Anyways, it’s not rumored that they are shopping them, so much as teams are calling about them. So no need to freak just yet. Staples did have a new article up about Leafs interest in Gagner, and what D we should swindle from them. Options suggested were Carl Gunnarsson (I might pick him just because his name is fucking awesome) or Luke Schenn. Both would be good additions to a team that started rebuilding last year (if you believe some of the crazy media trying to suggest that). 


Anyways, it’s pretty clear to see that the rebuild really started in 2007 whether Katz, Lowe or Tambellini (to his credit, he wasn’t involved then) were aware or not. I’m not going to give them credit in this rebuild for fucking up for 4 years (06/07, 07/08, 08/09, 09/10) before this rebuild SUPPOSEDLY started. The notion that it started at the end of last year is ridiculous anyways.


P.S…. added a poll for the question of the week.


&lt;/blockquote&gt;

You won&#039;t convince me that the rebuild started the year after we made it to the Stanley cup finals. You won&#039;t convince me that the rebuild started in &#039;07, and trading for Heatley in &#039;09 is not a move indicative of a team in rebuild mode. I&#039;d say the team had beliefs that the rebuild was inevitable by the summer of &#039;08, and given the injuries of &#039;09 it became a no brainer. I could be convinced that the Oilers management had a notion that rebuild was inevitable, but the Heatley trade remains as evidence of management not being convinced. I voted &#039;09 for the true beginning of formal rebuild mode. Do you remember the optimism that surrounded the team the summer going into &#039;08. Rookie line and the late season run made people think we had something special going into &#039;08. Injuries and the sophomore jinx reared it&#039;s ugly head. Then I&#039;d say management first realized a true rebuild was necessary.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote cite="comment-40679">
<p><strong><a href="#comment-40679" rel="nofollow">Racki</a></strong>:<br />
Oh wow, is this one early for this coming Monday??  </p>
<p>Anyways, I think it’s silly too if the Oilers are really considering trading Gagner or Peckham. But, it does depend on the return, yes. If Nashville called saying “We’ll take Peckham and Gagner for Weber”, for example, I’d hang up the phone immediately and send it in to the NHL for approval. Anyways, it’s not rumored that they are shopping them, so much as teams are calling about them. So no need to freak just yet. Staples did have a new article up about Leafs interest in Gagner, and what D we should swindle from them. Options suggested were Carl Gunnarsson (I might pick him just because his name is fucking awesome) or Luke Schenn. Both would be good additions to a team that started rebuilding last year (if you believe some of the crazy media trying to suggest that). </p>
<p>Anyways, it’s pretty clear to see that the rebuild really started in 2007 whether Katz, Lowe or Tambellini (to his credit, he wasn’t involved then) were aware or not. I’m not going to give them credit in this rebuild for fucking up for 4 years (06/07, 07/08, 08/09, 09/10) before this rebuild SUPPOSEDLY started. The notion that it started at the end of last year is ridiculous anyways.</p>
<p>P.S…. added a poll for the question of the week.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>You won&#8217;t convince me that the rebuild started the year after we made it to the Stanley cup finals. You won&#8217;t convince me that the rebuild started in &#8217;07, and trading for Heatley in &#8217;09 is not a move indicative of a team in rebuild mode. I&#8217;d say the team had beliefs that the rebuild was inevitable by the summer of &#8217;08, and given the injuries of &#8217;09 it became a no brainer. I could be convinced that the Oilers management had a notion that rebuild was inevitable, but the Heatley trade remains as evidence of management not being convinced. I voted &#8217;09 for the true beginning of formal rebuild mode. Do you remember the optimism that surrounded the team the summer going into &#8217;08. Rookie line and the late season run made people think we had something special going into &#8217;08. Injuries and the sophomore jinx reared it&#8217;s ugly head. Then I&#8217;d say management first realized a true rebuild was necessary.</p>
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